louisgray.com - Latest Comments in http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Daniel J. Pritchett — Tue, 05 May 2009 11:36:33 -0000

Daniel, I wanted to share this vignette with you on modeling your life after successful famous people:

"Professor Rebecca Henderson at MIT's Sloan School shows how easily we succumb to the temptation to "explain" seemingly significant outcomes that are entirely random. "I begin my course in strategic management by asking all the students in the room to stand up," she says. "I then ask each of them to toss a coin. If the toss comes up tails, they are to sit down, but if it comes up heads, they are to remain standing. Since there are around 70 students in the class, after six or seven rounds there is only one student left standing. With the appropriate theatrics, I approach the student and say, 'How did you do that? Seven heads in a row! Can I interview you in Fortune? Is it the T-shirt? Is it the flick of the wrist? Can I write a case study about you?'"" -HBR via Knowledge Jolt with Jack

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

@drewshope — Tue, 05 May 2009 11:12:40 -0000

I agree. The ONLY class I really like in school was Intro to Literature. Maybe I just picked the wrong major. And maybe it's just what I get for going to a state school.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Rick Bucich — Mon, 04 May 2009 23:40:06 -0000

I caught that discussion but my position was pretty well covered so I didn't contribute. So much of college is more than just the degree which is a message that gets lost sometimes. I have a relative who is finishing a bachelors through an online program. She will end up with a degree but will miss out on what could arguably be the most important aspects of college life, that which takes place outside the classroom. Will she better off than someone who spent 3 years at a university but didn't finish? What I am certain, she won't come away with the fondness of the experience and the relationships that she would otherwise have. Whether it is right for everyone is another story altogether. In the case of Daniel (from what I can tell) the answer is a very solid yes, he is cut out for college and he would benefit from it.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Adam Singer — Mon, 04 May 2009 20:50:26 -0000

FriendFeed frames are pretty neat, didn't realize you could do that. Gave me an idea, thanks Louis.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

John E. Bredehoft (Empoprises) — Mon, 04 May 2009 20:11:57 -0000

When I mentioned Paul Bragdon and Reed College in the FriendFeed thread, I neglected to note one thing that Steve Jobs and I have in common - we both went to Reed. I just spent a little longer there than he did. I've talked about this before, but suffice it to say that Jobs did learn a lot in his six months at Reed that he may not have learned otherwise. Let me quote a bit from Jobs' Stanford address:

Reed College at that time offered perhaps the best calligraphy instruction in the country. Throughout the campus every poster, every label on every drawer, was beautifully hand calligraphed. Because I had dropped out and didn't have to take the normal classes, I decided to take a calligraphy class to learn how to do this. I learned about serif and san serif typefaces, about varying the amount of space between different letter combinations, about what makes great typography great. It was beautiful, historical, artistically subtle in a way that science can't capture, and I found it fascinating.

None of this had even a hope of any practical application in my life. But ten years later, when we were designing the first Macintosh computer, it all came back to me. And we designed it all into the Mac. It was the first computer with beautiful typography. If I had never dropped in on that single course in college, the Mac would have never had multiple typefaces or proportionally spaced fonts. And since Windows just copied the Mac, its likely that no personal computer would have them. If I had never dropped out, I would have never dropped in on this calligraphy class, and personal computers might not have the wonderful typography that they do. Of course it was impossible to connect the dots looking forward when I was in college. But it was very, very clear looking backwards ten years later.

Now some may say that Jobs had this opportunity because he dropped out of college, but I submit that he never would have had that opportunity if he had never enrolled in college in the first place.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Daniel Brusilovsky — Mon, 04 May 2009 19:01:09 -0000

I haven't considered college out 100%. I went to dinner with my mom last night to discuss college, and we've made a plan that I've agreed to more then 75% :) I'll announce more over the summer.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Jonathan Ghaly — Mon, 04 May 2009 18:51:11 -0000

Hey Drew,
I think the meaning of education is the issue here. I agree with you to an extent. I think the whole understanding of university (universitas=the whole, total) is lost today and college is just seen as means to the end of working. But for centuries university, and education, meant an introduction to all of reality, those years that one can ask the greatest questions of life(why are we here in the first place?eg), in other words, a time of freedom thats not utilitarian. As a liberal arts major, I experienced this freedom for 4 years and read some of the greatest books, had some of the best conversations with the greatest minds Id ever come across, about history, philosophy, culture, literature, politics, ethics...and what it has to do with us today. In this sense I feel like it was well worth it. Has that helped me get a job? Teaching yes. Real estate not really. But here I am, busy as hell in real estate. Point: life is not all work and money

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Jeff Jackson — Mon, 04 May 2009 18:22:15 -0000

I agree, and I am not saying they should have stayed in school, only that going to college sparked their creation.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Rudy Godoy — Mon, 04 May 2009 18:19:18 -0000

College is not meant to be a workforce production machine. It only gives you training. You are the one choosing where to focus the knowledge you've acquired.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Louis Gray — Mon, 04 May 2009 18:14:31 -0000

Click "Share" on any discussion. There is an embed code that uses iFrames. I changed the height and width to match the site.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Jesse Stay — Mon, 04 May 2009 18:12:25 -0000

They were also making good money when most of them dropped out.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Jesse Stay — Mon, 04 May 2009 18:11:55 -0000

Is there a trick to doing those FriendFeed embeds?

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

@drewshope — Mon, 04 May 2009 18:10:46 -0000

As a proud college dropout and a 24-year-old entrepreneur, all I can say to the vast multitudes of youngins is that college WILL NOT guarantee you a job. I have had COUNTLESS arguments with fresh-faced freshman who are convinced (because it has been shoved down their throats since birth) that College = job = house in suburbs. It's just *what you are supposed to do.* If going to U of Wherever-the-hell to be an "undeclared seeking business" major, or something similarly trivial, don't waste your time and your parents money. Get some real experience, figure out what you ACTUALLY want to do with your life, determine if that career path needs a degree, and do it. Your parents will appreciate NOT wasting the equivalent of a new Benz per semester, and you will end up NOT being another Communications Major working at Starbucks.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Jeff Jackson — Mon, 04 May 2009 18:09:24 -0000

True that Steve Jobs, Mark Zuckerberg, Bill Gates, Dell did not finish school, but it was college that helped create their product. Not to mention Google, Yahoo and others we started from colleges.

I will say college need to adapt and change to new tech and teaching methods. Classes are taught the same now as when my grandparents went to college (well if they went to college). My masters is in higher education, and I would for colleges and universities for 10 yrs and I will say college is not for everyone. LeBron James would not have been a better basketball player if he went to college. The best reasons to go are not necessarily in the classroom.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Rob Diana — Mon, 04 May 2009 18:01:00 -0000

That is a fantastic thread, with a whole bunch of different opinions.

Re: http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/05/great-debate-is-college-right-path-to.html

Louis Gray — Mon, 04 May 2009 17:57:00 -0000

Following on to the weekend thread. (And check out the FriendFeed embed)